IRC log of dig on 2013-09-03

Timestamps are in UTC.

06:22:22 [bblfish]
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13:30:58 [rajaniemi.freenode.net]
topic is: Decentralized Information Group @ MIT http://dig.csail.mit.edu/
13:30:58 [rajaniemi.freenode.net]
Users on #dig: DIGlogger RalphS bblfish deiu melvster presbrey Yudai_ slvrbckt betehess detrate ericP mattl sandro bergi tyteen4a03 zuzak
13:35:23 [timbl]
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16:46:32 [amy]
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16:46:50 [amy]
hey Joe? are you back today? still want your time w/ Tim at 1pm? I know he'd like to see you
17:46:44 [deiu]
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18:43:41 [timbl]
deiu ?
18:43:48 [deiu]
yes
18:44:02 [timbl]
curl -HContent-type:text/n3 --upload-file empty.n3 https://timbl.rww.io/test2/state.n3
18:44:03 [timbl]
<h1>403 Forbidden</h1>
18:44:22 [timbl]
Is something is public, one still needs a cert etc?
18:44:33 [deiu]
I don't think so
18:45:00 [deiu]
do you have an .acl file for the root dir?
18:45:05 [timbl]
Try url -HContent-type:text/n3 --upload-file /dev/null https://timbl.rww.io/test2/state.n3
18:45:22 [timbl]
not for root only for test2 IIRC
18:45:50 [deiu]
let me check something
18:58:11 [deiu]
oh, you have an .acl for test2
18:58:29 [deiu]
and it only allows append and read
18:58:40 [deiu]
your curl command is doing a PUT
19:01:06 [deiu]
timbl, try doing a POST instead
19:01:18 [deiu]
or set the acl to allow Write
19:04:42 [timbl]
or maybe i didn't
19:08:25 [timbl]
I used the ui
19:09:45 [deiu]
I just POSTed to a resource test.n3
19:10:44 [deiu]
the UI offers 3 options: Read / Write / Append
19:12:55 [bblfish]
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19:13:04 [timbl]
I just changed it to write from append
19:13:38 [deiu]
does it work now?
19:13:43 [timbl]
You used POST not PUT -- what did you expect to happen?
19:14:58 [timbl]
ok my put works now
19:14:58 [deiu]
I expected it to work and it did
19:15:23 [timbl]
you expected a POST to "work" meaning "append this data to the null graph" ?
19:15:25 [deiu]
I wasn't sure what method your curl command was using
19:15:34 [timbl]
if yopu POST more, will it append ?
19:15:46 [deiu]
I expected it to create a new resource if there wasn't one
19:16:03 [deiu]
and yes, POST will always append
19:16:20 [deiu]
and create the resource if it doesn't already exist
19:18:17 [deiu]
did you click on Append by mistake or was the UI confusing?
19:19:24 [timbl]
I think I maybe wanted to play with append
19:19:41 [timbl]
BTW if append is set then maybe I should be able to load a new file to a directory
19:20:03 [timbl]
as it is just monotonic increasing info
19:20:21 [timbl]
so append ought to have been enough
19:20:24 [deiu]
well, append basically just allows POST
19:20:37 [deiu]
without GET or PUT
19:20:54 [timbl]
The issue is not the particular syntax, command, method used -- it is the semantics of it
19:20:55 [deiu]
it's useful if you want to have an endpoint to which people can write
19:21:03 [betehess]
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19:21:47 [timbl]
If the semantics are I am just adding stuff and not overwriting anything then APPEND should allow it surely, even if I am doing a INSERT DATA {} patch
19:22:02 [betehess]
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19:22:54 [deiu]
yes, but that means having to interpret the semantics of your actions
19:25:10 [deiu]
in your case, the PUT method implies having to overwrite the resource, which does not match the semantics of Append
19:26:24 [deiu]
it's important to separate PUT from POST, since there would be no way to indicate that I want to overwrite a resource, even if the contents of the new resource do not match the old ones
19:26:24 [timbl]
Agreed. if the resource exists
19:26:49 [deiu]
I see
19:27:31 [timbl]
maybe a security flaw is poking to see if the resource exits, but otherwise kinda nice to be able to untar a whole lot of stuff into an empty tree with append only
19:27:38 [timbl]
like adding log files
19:28:20 [timbl]
or adding pictures --- had a case more than once with dropbox of a recipient just deleting the pictures shared with him to save his disk quota -- but deleting them for very one else too
19:28:46 [timbl]
(In dropbox anyone who is shred loses quota for the size of the files!)
19:28:56 [deiu]
ouch
19:28:57 [timbl]
who is shared
19:29:14 [timbl]
so with many shares they effectively make lots of money
19:29:33 [timbl]
I must seup an an rsync of my dropbox to stop that happening
19:30:08 [deiu]
I'll try to implement append for PUT if the resource doesn't exist
19:30:25 [timbl]
Meanwhile, I have my app installed OK at https://timbl.rww.io/test2/skin2.html
19:30:31 [timbl]
but it doesn't run
19:31:03 [deiu]
js app?
19:32:16 [deiu]
was it supposed to display anything?
19:33:00 [timbl]
yes, a (empty) list of issues
19:33:04 [timbl]
Issue Tracker
19:33:05 [timbl]
Issue list
19:33:06 [timbl]
New Issue
19:33:07 [timbl]
(You do not have your Web Id set. Sign in or sign up to make changes.)
19:33:08 [timbl]
Tip: Do you have web ID?
19:33:09 [timbl]
Start your own new tracker
19:33:10 [timbl]
____
19:33:16 [timbl]
stuff like that
19:34:03 [timbl]
It shows a mashup version of https://timbl.data.fm/test2/tracker.n3#TheTracker
19:34:24 [deiu]
it seems to load everything ok
19:34:48 [timbl]
Oh, hang on … the internal links are for data.fm
19:34:50 [timbl]
that's why
19:34:54 [timbl]
my bad
19:39:02 [timbl]
fixed, reload you get a tracker
19:39:22 [deiu]
oh nice
19:39:46 [timbl]
it has all the code locally, it is independet
19:41:03 [timbl]
it should be able in a bit to spawn itself into another storage
19:41:18 [deiu]
a complete web app, running on a personal R/W data space
19:41:21 [deiu]
pretty cool!
19:41:38 [timbl]
Yes :-)
19:43:05 [timbl]
locator works like that?
19:43:38 [timbl]
(locator doesn't seem to like my logic)
19:44:27 [deiu]
yes
19:45:14 [deiu]
it's actually app-to-app, passing through the WebID profile of each friend
19:45:32 [timbl]
assuming an editbale profile
19:45:38 [deiu]
but it deploys like the tracket
19:45:41 [deiu]
tracker*
19:45:52 [deiu]
yes
19:47:14 [deiu]
hmm, getting a WebID through the tracker does not work
19:49:11 [deiu]
bblfish, I was thinking whether or not it would useful to standardize a protocol to create WebIDs
19:50:21 [deiu]
or at least to semantically describe an endpoint that can be used to create WebIDs
20:07:46 [presbrey]
flying back to mit tonight :) cya all soon!
20:08:25 [deiu]
have a nice flight, presbrey :)
20:09:02 [presbrey]
diglogger, save me a pointer :)
20:09:02 [presbrey]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'save me a pointer :)', presbrey. Try /msg DIGlogger help
20:09:10 [presbrey]
thanks deiu
20:09:40 [amy]
hey Andrei, hey Joe :)
20:09:45 [amy]
yes, have a nice flight!
20:10:14 [deiu]
hi Amy, how are you? :)
20:13:39 [amy]
i'm good thank you :)
20:13:44 [amy]
how are you?
20:14:00 [deiu]
I'm great, thanks
20:14:04 [amy]
glad to hear!
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