IRC log of dig on 2013-09-19

Timestamps are in UTC.

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09:50:54 [bblfish]
deiu: let me know what ontology you are using for events
09:51:30 [bblfish]
also I am looking for an ontology for notifications. Say you want to specify what kinds of events should produce notifications to you ( e-mail, or pingback )
09:55:17 [deiu]
var EVENTS = $rdf.Namespace('http://purl.org/NET/c4dm/event.owl#');
09:55:17 [deiu]
var TIME = $rdf.Namespace('http://purl.org/NET/c4dm/timeline.owl#');
09:55:17 [deiu]
var DC = $rdf.Namespace('http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/');
09:55:17 [deiu]
var FOAF = $rdf.Namespace('http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/');
09:55:17 [deiu]
var UI = $rdf.Namespace('http://www.w3.org/ns/ui#');
09:55:31 [deiu]
that's what I'm using
09:55:41 [deiu]
UI is for event color
10:00:10 [deiu]
I would like to use one resource document per event (1-to-1 mapping) but it's complicated when one has lots of events
10:04:06 [deiu]
it looks like purl.org is not responding
10:09:48 [bblfish]
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10:12:34 [bblfish]
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10:15:01 [bblfish]
curl -i http://purl.org/NET/c4dm/event.owl has a problem
10:15:06 [bblfish]
can't dereference it
10:15:40 [bblfish]
you should avoid using ontologies that don't dereference: it means its devs did not understand the semweb, or that it's not being maintained
10:16:04 [deiu]
it used to work a few days ago
10:16:16 [deiu]
though slow, and with many redirects
10:19:10 [bblfish]
what do you want to do with these event ontolgies?
10:19:23 [bblfish]
I mean what kinds of events do you want to describe?
10:20:34 [bblfish]
I think I saw this ontology a while ago
10:20:45 [bblfish]
it's here now http://motools.sourceforge.net/timeline/timeline.html
10:20:59 [bblfish]
( the html description is )
10:23:51 [deiu]
a simply agenda event
10:25:13 [bblfish]
yes. I need that too
10:26:03 [bblfish]
Even for something as simple as sending mails at regular intervals. I wonder if it has the notion of regular intervals
10:27:28 [bblfish]
there is owl time
10:28:21 [bblfish]
http://www.w3.org/2006/time#
10:29:54 [deiu]
s/simply/simple
10:32:09 [deiu]
it has intervalStart and intervalEnds
10:32:15 [deiu]
I can work with that
10:32:32 [deiu]
I just need start/end/all day
10:32:46 [deiu]
actually, just start/end
10:37:31 [bblfish]
that seems to be defined in http://www.w3.org/2006/time#
10:38:56 [deiu]
yes
10:39:00 [deiu]
I'll switch
10:50:38 [deiu]
I can't find a way to say an event takes place over the whole day
10:51:35 [deiu]
which is not the same as saying: intervalStarts=intervalFinishes
10:53:09 [deiu]
hmm
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11:13:16 [bblfish]
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11:13:24 [deiu]
bblfish, http://www.semanticdesktop.org/ontologies/ncal/
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14:01:50 [bblfish]
deiu: I wonder if this is the continuation of ncal https://developer.gnome.org/ontology/unstable/scal-properties.html
14:04:06 [deiu]
oh, it looks like a vocab that fits my current app
14:04:32 [deiu]
scal - social cal?
14:05:31 [deiu]
Simplified Calendar Ontology
14:05:47 [deiu]
so far it seems usable
14:24:55 [bblfish]
http://www.aaai.org/ocs/index.php/KR/KR2010/paper/viewFile/1280/1673
14:26:25 [bblfish]
"Ontologies for Dates and Duration" Michael Gruninger
14:28:28 [deiu]
do you have any special requirements?
14:31:22 [bblfish]
well, I was trying to understand the space first
14:32:02 [bblfish]
I have a simple use case of wanting to allow people to have mails digests of events sent to them at particular times
14:32:45 [bblfish]
for this I probably don't need any of the above. But then again this type of thing seems to me to be so basic that we'll need it all the time
14:32:50 [bblfish]
( so to speak )
14:33:39 [bblfish]
It's a pitty that there are not examples for the nepomuk time ontology
14:35:06 [deiu]
I'll keep digging
14:36:09 [bblfish]
I think what is missing from the w3c time ontology is the notion of repeating events.
14:36:21 [bblfish]
but that's perhaps not missing, just somwhere else
14:41:46 [deiu]
my agenda app is working :)
14:41:49 [bblfish]
yes, it's going to take a bit of work to compare these ontologies
14:42:04 [deiu]
https://github.com/rww-apps/ld-cal
14:42:41 [deiu]
btw bblfish, if you have a javascript that can be deployed as a standalone web app, you can add it to https://github.com/rww-apps/
14:42:45 [deiu]
I'll grant you access
14:43:30 [deiu]
s/javascript/js app
14:44:04 [deiu]
melvster, https://github.com/rww-apps/ld-cal
14:44:12 [bblfish]
nice
14:52:38 [bblfish]
oh, I did not realise there really was a xsd:duration dataType
14:57:29 [deiu]
melvster, don't forget ld-cal is still a work in progress, if you want to test it
14:58:07 [deiu]
there's no dialog page to select where you want to store the data - it will store it in the same dir
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15:10:21 [melvster]
bblfish: notifications are semi implemented in the tabulator microblogging pane
15:17:47 [bblfish]
ah? What ontology do they use, do you know?
15:18:22 [bblfish]
I suppose that if TimBL had a banking application that would also use some kind of repeating payment ontology
15:28:10 [bblfish]
melvster: what do these notifications do? Do you mean ping ?
15:29:02 [bblfish]
ping= someone posts something and then tries to find ping endpoints for people
15:29:14 [bblfish]
and sends them a notification.
15:32:06 [melvster]
bblfish: based on SIOC
15:32:24 [melvster]
what happens is that notifications go into a separate area
15:32:34 [melvster]
e.g. you are following someone and they make a post
15:32:40 [melvster]
then you get notified
15:32:59 [melvster]
if you look at tabulator panes under microblog/ directory you can see the code and all the vocabs used
15:33:15 [bblfish]
they know you are following because you subscribe to their notification box?
15:33:34 [melvster]
bblfish: sioc has a follows predicate so you have a list of people you are following
15:35:38 [melvster]
so you have a microblog of *your* posts then you have a microblog of the people you're following
15:36:08 [melvster]
just a simple workflow i guess
15:36:19 [melvster]
but at least a start ...
15:37:46 [melvster]
bblfish: so to answer your question you have a notifications area and triples are put in there by the people you follow
15:38:08 [timbl]
(dieu, There are bugs in the query engine. I haven't seen " onDone is triggered before onResult finishes iterating through the results" before. )
15:38:19 [bblfish]
ok, but that requires them to know you follow them
15:39:00 [bblfish]
I have been looking at event systems a lot in JS and Scala recently
15:39:06 [melvster]
bbflish: http://rdfs.org/sioc/ns#container_of
15:39:23 [melvster]
the microblog contains post links via the predicate above (SIOC) ^^
15:39:42 [bblfish]
usually you have a way to subscribe to be notified of events of a certain type
15:40:02 [melvster]
makes sense
15:40:22 [melvster]
i think we need to do a bit of dogfooding before we get the workflows perfected ...
15:40:28 [melvster]
some trial and error ...
15:41:06 [bblfish]
so often you have an event bus, and you subscribe to events of a certain type on the event bus
15:41:35 [bblfish]
this of course requires you to tell the bus where to post notifications
15:41:55 [melvster]
true
15:42:25 [melvster]
i seem to remember reuters did something like that for realtime finance
15:42:40 [melvster]
i suspect there's been a few implementations
15:43:07 [bblfish]
yes, I doubt they did it with linked data.
15:43:14 [bblfish]
we had something before LDP was out http://bblfish.net/tmp/2011/05/09/
15:43:27 [bblfish]
but we could update that for LDP sometime soon.
15:43:39 [melvster]
no they used hard coded numbers as identifiers (FIDS)
15:43:55 [melvster]
not very extensible
15:44:02 [melvster]
but then they had a sort of monopoly
15:49:26 [bblfish]
The Web2.0 crowd then went on to invent webmention http://webmention.org/ ( at least they cite our work on pingback )
15:51:09 [melvster]
bblfish: that's sandeep ... not really web 2.0 ... he's part of RWW too ... more like web 2.5 ... they are the indie web community ... they are starting from the 'my homepage is my identity' paradigm
15:51:31 [melvster]
bblfish: he's very interested in linked data but doesnt understand all the principles yet, he's a pretty good guy
15:51:59 [bblfish]
Ah yes, when I wrote pingback I was thinking web 2.5 too. But now I am in Web3.0 land
15:52:16 [melvster]
best place to be :)
15:52:43 [melvster]
im pretty excited about stample, once we have a few linked data sites working together the network effect will start to grow polynomially
15:53:27 [sandro]
the network effect is exponential, not polynomial, I believe.
15:54:13 [sandro]
and the base of the exponent is the branching factor -- that is, for every new user, how many other new users do they bring? The exponent is how long it takes them to bring them.
15:54:20 [bblfish]
melvster I could not find a microblog/ directory in the tabluator github project
15:54:22 [melvster]
sandro: well the number of possible connections in a graph is n*(n-1)/2 ... but it's all good, I'll take exponential! :D
15:54:52 [melvster]
bblfish: under panes, let me get you the link
15:55:13 [melvster]
bblfish: https://github.com/linkeddata/tabulator/tree/master/js/panes/microblogPane
15:55:26 [sandro]
My point is mostly that growth comes from people convincing other people to use the system. If every new user drags in a few other new users, you win. If they don't, you lose.
15:55:57 [melvster]
sure, works for me! :)
15:56:01 [bblfish]
ah ok found it
15:56:07 [melvster]
bblfish: i blogged part 1 about this here: http://www.w3.org/community/rww/2013/08/15/distributed-microblogging-with-rww-io-and-tabulator/
15:56:17 [melvster]
ill do a follow up post once ive checked in some fixes
15:56:30 [melvster]
and explain how following and notifications work
15:56:56 [melvster]
im just cleaning up what charles did first, then ill make some improvements
15:58:15 [bblfish]
ah yes, that's helpful.
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16:28:45 [bblfish]
it's quite impressive all the work that was put into iCal modelling ...
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