IRC log of dig on 2010-08-10

Timestamps are in UTC.

00:10:12 [presbrey]
ericP, another parser exception
00:10:17 [presbrey]
do you prefer them here or email?
00:10:41 [presbrey]
[Mon Aug 09 20:08:58 2010] [error] mod_fcgid: process /srv/dig/www/wiki/handler.py(16961) exit(communication error), get unexpected signal 6
00:10:41 [presbrey]
terminate called after throwing an instance of 'w3c_sw::ParserException'
00:10:41 [presbrey]
what(): @base <http://foaf.me/testdatawiki> .@prefix rdf: <http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#> .@prefix rdfs: <http://www.w3.org/2000/01/rdf-schema#> .@prefix foaf: <http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/> .@prefix rsa: <http://www.w3.org/ns/auth/rsa#> .@prefix cert: <http://www.w3.org/ns/auth/cert#> .@prefix admin: <http://webns.net/mvcb/> .<> a foaf:PersonalProfileDocument ; foaf:maker <#me> ; foaf:primaryTopic <#me> .<#me> a foaf:Person ;
00:10:42 [presbrey]
foaf:family_name "familyname" ; foaf:givenname "firstname" ; foaf:homepage <> ; foaf:nick "testdatawiki" .:1.1-5: syntax error, unexpected LANGTAG, expecting end of file
00:12:36 [oshani]
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02:45:54 [timbl]
DIGlogger, pointer?
02:45:54 [timbl]
See http://dig.csail.mit.edu/irc/dig/2010-08-10#T02-45-54
02:48:10 [knappy]
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02:51:48 [knappy]
Hi Tim are you here?
03:07:05 [kennyluck]
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03:14:03 [ericP]
presbrey, escaping bug should be fixed -- re-building in a screen now
03:17:03 [ericP]
timbl, you also make be intersted in that, but i'm not sure where to copy the .so to make it available to the scripts
03:23:13 [timbl]
Um /srv somewhere I expect.. I think Joe mentioned on IRC way back
03:23:55 [timbl]
03:19:44 [presbrey]
03:23:55 [timbl]
ericP, i copied swobjcts.[py,so] so rebuilds dont break the actual wiki space
03:23:55 [timbl]
03:20:15 [presbrey]
03:23:56 [timbl]
copy to /srv/dig/lib/python to 'install'
03:24:06 [timbl]
^ from http://dig.csail.mit.edu/irc/dig/2010-08-09.html
03:24:18 [timbl]
Is that what you want?
03:24:35 [timbl]
ericp
03:25:04 [timbl]
great that bug is fixed.
03:31:28 [presbrey]
did you guys try tabulator.org/wiki/ :)
03:31:57 [timbl]
tabulator.org?
03:32:12 [timbl]
what is that running?
03:32:18 [timbl]
I forget
03:32:34 [presbrey]
the data wiki
03:32:46 [timbl]
this one?
03:32:53 [presbrey]
yeah melvster and i connected it earlier
03:32:59 [timbl]
great
03:33:19 [timbl]
he installed it or poxied
03:33:21 [presbrey]
maybe 2 hours ago on swig
03:33:29 [presbrey]
changed the domain record
03:33:29 [timbl]
proxied .. must be installed
03:34:07 [presbrey]
i put up a jquery data fetching issue tracker data
03:34:11 [presbrey]
http://presbrey.scripts.mit.edu/tabulator.html
03:34:53 [presbrey]
s/demo/data
03:35:20 [timbl]
Let%27s%20see%20whether%20we%20can%20add%20a%20comment.%2023%3A15 ?
03:35:36 [presbrey]
oh check my source
03:35:43 [presbrey]
i just called encode() if it was a literal
03:35:50 [timbl]
I know that need encodeing, nor URI encoding :-)
03:35:51 [presbrey]
htmlentities i think maybe right
03:36:25 [timbl]
But yes you could build thinks like a web page to report a new bug pretty easily
03:36:32 [timbl]
just using rdflib
03:36:44 [timbl]
we need to revamp the data widgets
03:36:52 [timbl]
of Jim's .
03:37:10 [presbrey]
which parts
03:39:42 [timbl]
Well, he almost finished portin them to the tabulator evnironment
03:40:22 [timbl]
And i have a higher-level single entry point to sparqlUpdate.js which we shoul probably use.
03:40:42 [presbrey]
interesting
03:40:43 [timbl]
(does dav untested, and sparql, and has a set of dletable statments and a set of insertable stataments)
03:41:23 [timbl]
kenny had done the DAV in a sparate module updateCenter but he did not appreaciate for example the bnode idntification stuff I think.
03:41:48 [timbl]
Have you tried to use the rdfwidgets?
03:42:01 [presbrey]
i did the 'getting started'
03:43:05 [presbrey]
i thought i saw some sparul'ing on some the ui elements
03:43:55 [presbrey]
im not sure about the sparql entry-point.
03:44:23 [presbrey]
i am curious about the hardcoded style classes. i guess that makes things easier
03:44:46 [lkagal]
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03:47:04 [timbl]
What would you expect instead of hard coded -- add a prefxi to them from the user?
03:49:31 [presbrey]
most stuff in apis ive seen now do their function defs like func([id/name], [options-hash])
03:50:00 [presbrey]
it'll take classname in the hash or method=x or whatever based on the kind of object
03:50:56 [presbrey]
i was working up to it with my jquery tabulator issues test
03:51:06 [presbrey]
most of the time i use prototype
03:52:01 [presbrey]
(i also just wanted to play with the json conneg on data wiki)
03:53:53 [presbrey]
looks like theres no good builtin js for that escape
04:00:57 [timbl]
<http://dig.xvm.mit.edu/wiki/tabulator/tracker/state#Iss1281411505977> <http://www.w3.org/2005/01/wf/flow#description> "Let's test it by entering some things like a quote mark " and a
04:00:57 [timbl]
new line. And a \ backslash.
04:00:57 [timbl]
" .
04:01:24 [timbl]
Was the encoding on tutle serialisation supposed to be fixed?
04:02:10 [timbl]
Doesnt seem to have changed
04:03:09 [timbl]
The js code to escape stuff is in js/rdf/types.js
04:03:10 [presbrey]
where
04:03:32 [timbl]
serialization bug? in state.n3
04:03:48 [presbrey]
oh from swobjects
04:03:55 [presbrey]
i wonder if ericP installed the new one
04:04:47 [timbl]
See IRC 23:17
04:09:52 [presbrey]
they look different to me
04:09:57 [presbrey]
ill copy it over
04:10:56 [lkagal]
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04:12:56 [presbrey]
ooh ericP put in an operationsset method
04:14:07 [presbrey]
timbl, retry your quotes
04:15:24 [timbl]
ok
04:16:56 [timbl]
sweet
04:17:07 [timbl]
<http://dig.xvm.mit.edu/wiki/tabulator/tracker/state#Iss1281411505977> <http://www.w3.org/2005/01/wf/flow#description> "Let's test it with a newline\nand a quote mark \" and one backslash \\ and two of them \\\\ .\nHow do that come out?" .
04:17:33 [presbrey]
haha nice
04:18:01 [timbl]
remind me -- there is a log of changes to each file? no
04:18:34 [presbrey]
queries/uri are being error logged
04:18:49 [timbl]
<http://dig.xvm.mit.edu/wiki/tabulator/tracker/state#Iss1281411505977> <http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#type> <http://dig.csail.mit.edu/2010/issues/track#Closed> .
04:19:04 [presbrey]
no per-statement change log
04:19:34 [presbrey]
we were talking about svn bloat last time
04:19:48 [timbl]
Ok. It would be grteat to have an n3 log in fact so that Oshani and Ian could use it as a trail of evidence of what people have done.
04:20:07 [timbl]
Provenance
04:20:08 [presbrey]
is there an n3diff.py example
04:20:23 [timbl]
umm
04:21:10 [presbrey]
sorry is there a schema you can point me at
04:22:06 [timbl]
http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/test/delta
04:22:29 [timbl]
http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/test/delta/detailed.tests
04:24:34 [timbl]
http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/test/delta/t2/smushed-patch.n3 is an example of a ptach file
04:25:09 [timbl]
where the left hand side o fthe "deleteion" is the WHERE
04:26:06 [timbl]
so your read it as "where ?account has account number 1234567-0 deleet that it has balance -400
04:26:38 [timbl]
in SPARQL WHERE { } .. DELETE {...]
04:27:01 [presbrey]
a del;insertion is what
04:27:05 [timbl]
Ok, s the dat awiki is in the no knownbugs stage
04:27:10 [timbl]
s/stage/state/
04:27:41 [timbl]
A del:insertion B is like WHERE A INSERT B
04:27:54 [presbrey]
i was hoping the log schema was going to map easily to subversion commit variables
04:28:35 [presbrey]
how are the logs requested
04:29:25 [timbl]
The diff.py program from SWAP will generate a strong diff between two files, provided it can find sufficient information in the Web to fully label the input graph
04:29:30 [knappy]
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04:29:43 [timbl]
"commit variables" ?
04:30:37 [timbl]
Ok, I have to go review a document before the morning.... the data wiki is looking good, suggest we use it for stuff.
04:30:50 [timbl]
Nothing like usingit for real stuff to test things out.
04:32:04 [presbrey]
vars like parts of the commit user, time, comment, files add/edit/del, diffs
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14:51:59 [DIGlogger]
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14:51:59 [leguin.freenode.net]
topic is: Decentralized Information Group @ MIT http://dig.csail.mit.edu/
14:51:59 [leguin.freenode.net]
Users on #dig: DIGlogger yosi melvster oshani lkagal RalphS drrho timbl webr3 amy presbrey Yudai_ ericP sandro nunnun_away gbot46
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19:24:18 [presbrey]
we've chatted today about returning sparql from forms other than those tabulator uses (insert/delete) eg. construct in data wiki and checking operation types with swobjects for acls
19:25:49 [presbrey]
its always nice when you wake up to new contributions based on yesterdays work. thx for styling webr3 and melvster :)
19:26:47 [melvster]
i didnt do much ... but it IS cool! :)
19:27:00 [presbrey]
yes its always cool to bring your data with you
19:28:11 [melvster]
quick question: is tabulator.org (without www) pointed correctly to 18.181.1.220 ?
19:28:21 [presbrey]
looks like it
19:28:45 [melvster]
ok good
19:29:45 [presbrey]
I would like to see a 'new issue' in webr3's
19:30:21 [presbrey]
compared to tabulator
19:31:22 [presbrey]
what are other apps good for data wikis... bookmarking?
19:31:51 [presbrey]
there should probably be a bookmarklet that sends a sparql insert
19:32:00 [melvster]
personally i would say bank account :)
19:32:14 [melvster]
just a balance and add/subtract
19:32:41 [presbrey]
ha good I haven't tested for any locking issues
19:32:42 [melvster]
maybe a bit of workflow ... aka the bank
19:36:52 [timbl]
Other apps good for data wikis -- yes, book mark, bookmark sync, calendaring (complicated) .. nything the WBS (w3c web-based surveys or survey money etc can do, ... doodle ..
19:37:14 [melvster]
voting perhaps
19:37:24 [melvster]
i guess that's surveys
19:40:55 [melvster]
i wonder if http://smob.me/ could be extended to be multi webid then you could do microblogging ...
19:45:06 [presbrey]
if you have a good microblog interface it would be nice if I could bring my webid and use your UI with the blog I link from my webid via sparql
19:47:39 [melvster]
smob me is alex passante
19:48:15 [melvster]
but it uses sparql and also pings sindice
19:49:36 [melvster]
i also wonder if it's possible to create simple games based on datawiki
19:50:00 [melvster]
i cant think of any web scale games, to date ...
20:04:03 [knappy]
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20:43:43 [timbl]
? ts always nice when you wake up to new contributions based on yesterdays work. thx for styling member:webr3 and member:melvster :) ?
20:43:53 [timbl]
styling?
20:44:28 [timbl]
DIGlogger, pointer?
20:44:28 [timbl]
See http://dig.csail.mit.edu/irc/dig/2010-08-10#T20-44-28
20:52:18 [kennyluck]
Wow, cool.
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21:24:14 [ericP]
presbrey, new t_SWObjects.py has tests with parseNTriples
21:24:46 [ericP]
+ test_construct, which has an assert to make sure it's a CONSTRUCT
21:27:47 [presbrey]
triples w/ variables
21:28:21 [presbrey]
how did you get 'member:' on those nicks timbl? I don't think I said that
21:30:02 [presbrey]
styling the http://www.tabulator.org/wiki/tabulator/tracker/state better than I did at presbrey.scripts.mit.edu/tabulator.html >> http://webr3.org/apps/rdfjson/
21:30:24 [presbrey]
both use the JSON conneg as someone pointed out on diggers email
21:30:57 [timbl]
Must be colloquy magic -- copied and I repasted yours p- another copy-cut interruption service
21:32:09 [timbl]
o i c
21:32:25 [timbl]
thought maybe they has used the ui:style field somewhere
21:37:03 [ericP]
presbrey, re: triples w/ variables, i forgot about that when i s/parseTriples/parseNTriples/g'd
21:38:32 [ericP]
i've also come up with another strategy besides getOperationType(), but i'm not sure how it will scale
21:42:12 [ericP]
if we'd like the result sparqlParser.parseQuery("CONSTRUCT...") to be a SWObjects.Construct instead of SWObjects.Operation, we can have C++ functions OperationAsConstruct(), OperationAsSelect() and either call them iteratively until one doesn't return None, or switch based getOperationType()
21:43:09 [ericP]
(the challenge is that statically typed languages return base classes while dynamically typed languages return final classes)
21:54:00 [presbrey]
I'm not sure what changes jambo did to ACL module for his project. I really need to go see
21:59:36 [presbrey]
timbl, too busy today but still dreaming of ACLs... ;)
22:07:51 [presbrey]
ericP
22:07:57 [presbrey]
the way you test things in python is like
22:08:02 [timbl]
They all connect -- the wiki allows the acl to be edited, the acl controls the wiki,
22:08:09 [presbrey]
if operation is OperationSelect:
22:08:17 [presbrey]
elif operation is OperationDelete:
22:08:36 [presbrey]
where OperationSelect, OperationDelete are classes theoretically inheriting Operation(object)
22:09:02 [presbrey]
the way you test s/things/object types/ in python
22:09:52 [ericP]
does the strategy i outlined seem appropriate for that?
22:09:55 [ericP]
(it does to me)
22:10:41 [presbrey]
its not clear to me what kind of object I'm going to end up with from OperationAsSelect after swig gets done with it
22:10:44 [presbrey]
but sure lets try
22:12:15 [presbrey]
I can make Cython bindings to redland C APIs easily and we can compare
22:12:44 [presbrey]
I know dajobe was doing operation type enum-style in sparql<1.1
22:13:25 [ericP]
what do you get back from a parser, an Opeation or a Construct?
22:13:25 [presbrey]
almost all of my bindings are broken with his 1.1 commits so I don't know yet
22:13:45 [ericP]
(sounds like you get an Operation and an enum you can test)
22:14:05 [presbrey]
I get back a graph pattern or set of patterns
22:14:16 [presbrey]
a pattern can have an operation, it has an enum
22:14:41 [presbrey]
actually the latest dev I was doing with it looked like a normalized string
22:16:00 [presbrey]
yep...
22:16:13 [presbrey]
also we call it a query 'verb'
22:16:20 [presbrey]
[presbrey@endor python-roqet]$ ./test.py group_union.sparql
22:16:20 [presbrey]
{'limit': -1,
22:16:20 [presbrey]
'order_by': [],
22:16:20 [presbrey]
'pattern': {'operator': 'Group',
22:16:20 [presbrey]
'patterns': [{'operator': 'Union',
22:16:21 [presbrey]
'patterns': [{'operator': 'Basic'},
22:16:23 [presbrey]
{'operator': 'Basic'}]},
22:16:25 [presbrey]
{'operator': 'Basic'}]},
22:16:29 [presbrey]
'variables': ['o', 'oc'],
22:16:31 [presbrey]
'verb': 'SELECT'}
22:16:54 [presbrey]
like I said this is a <1.1 example as you know with OperationSets but thats the basic
22:17:27 [presbrey]
presumably I can descend pattern['patterns'][...] evaluating ACL constraints
22:18:40 [presbrey]
haha...
22:18:45 [presbrey]
[presbrey@endor python-roqet]$ ./test.py insert.sparql
22:18:45 [presbrey]
{'error_code': 1,
22:18:45 [presbrey]
'error_messages': [{'line': 1,
22:18:45 [presbrey]
'message': 'INSERT cannot be used with SPARQL',
22:18:45 [presbrey]
'uri': 'http://null/'}]}
22:19:03 [presbrey]
I probably need git Redland
22:21:17 [presbrey]
to steal a line from a great movie
22:21:30 [presbrey]
swobjects, you had me at INSERT ;)
22:24:16 [ericP]
nice
22:28:33 [presbrey]
if(query->verb != RASQAL_QUERY_VERB_CONSTRUCT)
22:29:17 [presbrey]
ha he starts his enum with UNKNOWN as well
22:30:29 [ericP]
btw, since i just renamed parseTriples, got a better name for it?
22:31:21 [ericP]
(the way i use it, UNKNOWN means OOPS)
22:32:16 [presbrey]
yep. no reason to care to have the enums overlap. just interesting
22:33:04 [presbrey]
I guess they are patterns to me; not triples
22:33:40 [presbrey]
uri/literal references (triples) + variables => patterns?
22:34:15 [presbrey]
triple patterns
22:42:05 [ericP]
parseNPatterns ?
22:42:20 [presbrey]
whats the N for?
22:42:33 [ericP]
NTriples
22:42:52 [presbrey]
NTP ok
22:42:53 [ericP]
to set the expectation of what syntactice shortcuts are available (specifically, none)
22:43:13 [ericP]
parseNTP ?
22:43:24 [ericP]
or is P in NTP for Parser?
22:43:39 [presbrey]
parseNTriplesPatterns
22:43:55 [presbrey]
NTP. justification for TTerm was that it appeared many times
22:44:12 [presbrey]
how much does parseNTriples
22:44:20 [presbrey]
parseNPatterns seems good
22:44:44 [presbrey]
if you call it NTP then virtually no one will know what it does from the name alone
22:45:18 [presbrey]
parseNPatterns loses the T
22:45:24 [presbrey]
parseNTPatterns?
22:46:11 [presbrey]
are you done with your toy for today?
22:47:30 [ericP]
the toy i was using to work out the graph cycle algorithm?
22:47:39 [ericP]
nah, playing with that now
22:48:10 [knappy]
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22:48:27 [ericP]
would you stumble across parseNTPatterns and guess what it does?
22:48:36 [ericP]
well, as well as any of the other proposals?
22:52:46 [ericP]
top candidates: parseNTriples, parseNPatterns, parseNTPatterns parseNTriplePatterns
22:53:23 [ericP]
2010-08-10T22:53:01Z <ericP> infobot, roll 'em
22:53:23 [ericP]
2010-08-10T22:53:01Z <infobot> you rolled ⚁⚀
22:53:35 [presbrey]
I can guess easily what parseNT does
22:53:35 [ericP]
hmm, forgot to assign numbers
22:53:44 [presbrey]
so parseNTPatterns seems to follow
22:54:30 [ericP]
done
22:54:35 [ericP]
well, doing...
22:58:53 [presbrey]
if only you knew python well ericp
22:58:54 [ericP]
done
22:59:06 [presbrey]
I'm sure you would be writing your toy in python and not c++
23:00:03 [ericP]
yeah, i know enough python to be able to cut and paste stuff from the web
23:00:25 [ericP]
is there a slick debugger that would allow me to step through and test my understanding of the program logic?
23:01:22 [ericP]
(that's how i'd choose the lang for exploratory code)
23:02:06 [presbrey]
I like Wing from Wingware
23:02:23 [presbrey]
they even issue OSS developers free Pro licenses
23:02:58 [presbrey]
http://wingware.com/wingide/screenshots
23:04:41 [ericP]
looks nice, indeed
23:05:20 [ericP]
i like the vadar UI
23:05:55 [presbrey]
ha at the bottom? me too. mine looks close to that
23:06:12 [presbrey]
its actually gtk+ theme stylable
23:07:24 [presbrey]
also has easy multi-windowing and frame-splitting, which is really nice w/ >1 monitor
23:08:37 [presbrey]
graphs, nodes, paths, searching, all that stuff I used to do in scheme... I do in python now
23:09:22 [presbrey]
even before 6.0(0)1 switched from scheme to python!
23:10:03 [presbrey]
python tuple types are hashable and namedtuples are even more delightful
23:10:12 [ericP]
some O'Reilly folks just gave me a Python for Bioinformatics book; i should crack the binding
23:10:49 [presbrey]
I point people at http://diveintopython.org/ sometimes
23:11:16 [presbrey]
though I've only read the section on unicode
23:16:38 [presbrey]
like most things it was learn by doing for me
23:17:54 [ericP]
yeah, i seem to be stuck to that as well
23:20:39 [yosi]
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23:21:57 [presbrey]
hijacking g++ throw: http://zbigg.blogspot.com/2009/03/hijacking-throw.html
23:22:43 [ericP]
oh right, i forgot about that mission
23:26:59 [presbrey]
yes ParserExceptions are still causing SIGABRT
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23:32:02 [ericP]
you don't like that?
23:37:19 [presbrey]
no
23:37:40 [presbrey]
do you?
23:40:37 [presbrey]
wiki]# ./test.py insert-fail.sparql
23:40:37 [presbrey]
terminate called after throwing an instance of 'w3c_sw::ParserException'
23:40:37 [presbrey]
what(): INSERT {
23:40:37 [presbrey]
:1.8-2.0: syntax error, unexpected end of file, expecting IT_GRAPH
23:40:37 [presbrey]
Aborted
23:41:00 [presbrey]
'w3c_sw::ParserException' need not terminate the wiki
23:41:16 [presbrey]
terminate abort or otherwise kill
23:56:23 [oshani]
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