IRC log of dig on 2012-05-30

Timestamps are in UTC.

11:10:20 [DIGlogger]
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topic is: Decentralized Information Group @ MIT http://dig.csail.mit.edu/
11:10:20 [verne.freenode.net]
Users on #dig: DIGlogger RalphS cheater_ deiu melvster presbrey betehess bblfish amy dsheets Pipian_ bergi mattl manu-db manu1 ericP Yudai_ sandro
12:00:11 [scor]
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12:01:15 [bblfish]
betehess: found a nice very simple solution https://gist.github.com/2835814
12:05:57 [bblfish]
betehess, I have someone here who is working with Banana RDF, just wanted to know if we could chat at some point
12:15:06 [melvster]
deiu: haha ... i just sent a pingback to myself :)
12:15:44 [melvster]
bergi: shall i try sending you a ping now?
12:20:04 [melvster]
can i add your webid to my profile? http://www.bergnet.org/people/bergi/card#me ?
12:23:44 [bblfish]
ohh! I am reaching functional programming green belt
12:24:19 [bblfish]
now I have cleanly defined functionally a WebAccessControlGuard https://gist.github.com/2835814
12:24:26 [deiu]
melvster, cool :0
12:24:27 [deiu]
:)
12:24:52 [melvster]
works great :)
12:25:19 [bblfish]
I wonder what betehess makes of that... :-)
12:25:28 [melvster]
bblfish: have you implemented webid+pingback, if so can I send you a message?
12:25:52 [bblfish]
I think I am relying on someone else's ping back end point
12:26:00 [bblfish]
but it may have been deiu's of a year ago
12:26:04 [bblfish]
let me look
12:26:58 [bblfish]
I have pingback:to <http://webid.fcns.eu/notification.php>;
12:27:16 [melvster]
you might want to update taht
12:27:24 [bblfish]
to what now?
12:28:04 [deiu]
https://my-profile.eu/pingback.php
12:28:11 [bblfish]
( otherwise I am just rewriting ReadWriteWeb in Play 2.0... This time it's going to be rock solid )
12:28:15 [melvster]
<http://melvincarvalho.com/#me> <http://purl.org/net/pingback/to> <https://my-profile.eu/notification.php> .
12:28:19 [melvster]
is what i have
12:28:38 [deiu]
melvster, I think it should be pingback.php
12:28:40 [deiu]
let me check
12:29:43 [bblfish]
ok I updated it to what deiu said and published it
12:30:25 [deiu]
bblfish, yep, it's pingback.php alright
12:30:30 [melvster]
oh right
12:30:33 [melvster]
strange
12:30:38 [melvster]
i was still getting messages
12:30:46 [melvster]
let me change mine too
12:31:33 [deiu]
well, notification.php handles local messages, but since local messages are also based on pingback...
12:31:39 [deiu]
:)
12:32:15 [melvster]
ok changed mine too
12:32:19 [deiu]
notification.php calls pingback.php to deliver the actual messages
12:32:51 [deiu]
dafuq am I saying
12:33:01 [deiu]
there is no notification.php anymore
12:33:16 [deiu]
I must have forgotten to remove the file from the server
12:34:07 [deiu]
messages.php handles all communication (through pingback)
12:35:45 [melvster]
cool i can still message myself
12:41:31 [melvster]
bblfish: i sent you a pingback
12:42:27 [melvster]
deiu: I just got
12:42:29 [melvster]
Not Found The requested URL /notification.php was not found on this server.
12:42:29 [melvster]
Apache/2.2.16 (Debian) Server at my-profile.eu Port 443
12:42:53 [melvster]
oh i still have http://fcns.eu/people/andrei/card#me
12:42:59 [melvster]
i should update that right?
12:43:28 [melvster]
to https://my-profile.eu/people/deiu/card#me
12:44:08 [melvster]
done
12:47:57 [bblfish]
ah let me look
12:49:57 [deiu]
yes
12:50:14 [deiu]
I'm using the profile on my-profile.eu
12:52:51 [bblfish]
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12:54:01 [bblfish]
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12:54:18 [bblfish]
oops disconneected
12:54:24 [bblfish]
where do I look up the pings?
12:54:38 [deiu]
you have to subscribe first
12:54:57 [deiu]
https://my-profile.eu/subscription.php
12:56:21 [bblfish]
oh! I see my ping!
12:56:27 [bblfish]
:-)
12:56:33 [bblfish]
melvster's ping
12:56:52 [melvster]
yay
12:57:03 [bblfish]
does it remember my account when I connect?
12:57:11 [bblfish]
so I don't have to
12:58:15 [bblfish]
I send melving a ping
12:58:22 [bblfish]
s/send/sent/
12:58:26 [deiu]
bblfish, yep
12:58:29 [bblfish]
ok, got a teleconf
12:58:31 [bblfish]
soon.
12:58:35 [bblfish]
but this is great fun :-)
12:59:02 [deiu]
you can even see messages sent to you even before you subscribed ;)
12:59:35 [deiu]
in theory, one can use this service to contact people and then let them know where to check their messages
12:59:44 [deiu]
like a voicemail service
13:00:37 [melvster]
yay i got your ping bblfish
13:02:50 [bblfish]
heh. This already feels like facebook
13:09:15 [melvster]
it's good
13:09:19 [melvster]
is very close
13:09:39 [melvster]
i think just need friends chat area (foaf : knows) and email alerts
13:34:30 [melvster]
deiu: i sent a pingback to kingsley and he just skyped me to say he got it
13:34:55 [melvster]
he gets an email notification on pingbacks ... i wonder could we also do that on my profile?
13:41:26 [deiu]
melvster, I guess so, yeah
13:41:33 [deiu]
though you do have an RSS feed for them :)
13:42:13 [melvster]
oh good point ... but for most people today email is still a focal point (we can help to change that tho!) :)
13:43:02 [deiu]
sending emails just adds another layer of complicity for the lambda user
13:43:23 [deiu]
imagine the spam you can generate with it :)
13:43:51 [deiu]
and besides, it "leaks" information since you can't delete the email once it's sent :)
13:44:29 [mari-mami]
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13:45:50 [melvster]
no it's good ... this is how most social networks operate
13:46:02 [melvster]
you bootstrap email
13:46:07 [melvster]
then people come onto the web
13:46:11 [melvster]
they make the transition
13:46:32 [melvster]
it's even better if you can turn notifications off, but to start with, it's a big help, imho
13:46:36 [melvster]
e.g. kingsley today
13:46:42 [melvster]
he got the email from his pingback
13:46:45 [melvster]
and skyped me
13:46:56 [melvster]
so we kind of completed the loop early
13:47:41 [melvster]
linkedin facebook myspace etc. all send you email notifications ...
13:52:00 [bblfish]
bblfish has quit (Remote host closed the connection)
13:52:32 [deiu]
I'll see what I can do
13:53:57 [deiu]
did Kingsley get an email with the message body as well?
14:01:57 [melvster]
let me ask him
14:05:59 [bblfish]
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14:10:55 [melvster]
"you are receiving this mail because you enabled Semantic Pingback notification (with email as notice mechanism) for your Personal Profile Management Data Space for WebID: http://id.myopenlink.net/dataspace/person/KingsleyUyiIdehen#this. You do not need to respond to this automated email."
14:11:17 [melvster]
it didnt have the message body
14:11:36 [mari-mami]
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14:14:53 [melvster]
ok let me try a form in jsfiddle now!
14:16:19 [melvster]
ok i made a gist https://gist.github.com/2836604
14:17:50 [bblfish]
When I click on "message" for Andrei on https://my-profile.eu/friends.php I don't get Andrei's webid in the message box
14:18:00 [bblfish]
of the resulting page
14:18:31 [bblfish]
btw, I think the url should be https://my-profile.eu/friends.php?webid=... to be RESTful, no?
14:21:52 [bblfish]
DIGlogger, pointer?
14:21:52 [bblfish]
See http://dig.csail.mit.edu/irc/dig/2012-05-30#T14-21-52
14:23:34 [melvster]
so i tried this: http://jsfiddle.net/9LbLz/
14:23:43 [melvster]
didnt seem to work yet tho
14:27:58 [melvster]
i wonder how the server knows the pingback namespace
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14:36:27 [melvster]
worked!!
14:36:28 [melvster]
http://jsfiddle.net/9LbLz/1/
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15:25:00 [deiu]
melvster, how do I know if my target user wants to receive email messages or not?
15:25:36 [melvster]
what most sites do is that they send you email by default but allow you to turn it off in your settings
15:25:52 [deiu]
but that's a poor way of doing it :)
15:26:02 [mari-mami]
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15:26:26 [melvster]
yes and no ... it's good for growth, and I think these days most people come to see this as the norm
15:27:13 [deiu]
indeed, but that applies to centralized applications
15:27:15 [rszeno]
normal way is to have a opt-in so they can decide
15:27:20 [deiu]
exactly
15:27:36 [deiu]
but how do you check this opt-in in a decentralized system?
15:27:49 [melvster]
ah good question
15:27:56 [rszeno]
pingback
15:27:58 [rszeno]
?
15:28:14 [deiu]
an extension for pingback...maybe
15:28:48 [deiu]
or maybe pingforth :P
15:28:52 [melvster]
it's specific to the service
15:29:12 [melvster]
so if im using pingback.php ... i should be able to tell pingback.php what my preference is
15:29:33 [deiu]
yes, but it's you (as the sender) who's specifying it
15:30:06 [deiu]
hmm
15:30:47 [melvster]
it's the receiver that gets the email, they get the choice
15:30:52 [melvster]
the other option is:
15:31:03 [melvster]
have different services one that emails one that doesnt
15:31:06 [melvster]
and the user chooses
15:31:17 [rszeno]
user options must be keepend on the sender side this is clear
15:31:20 [melvster]
but i do thing most will want email as an option at least
15:33:01 [deiu]
I think it should be the service that delivers the notification (to which the user is subscribed to)
15:35:26 [melvster]
yes so i send you a ping ... your pingback service will send you the notification
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15:59:21 [timbl]
bblfish?
15:59:28 [bblfish]
yes
15:59:48 [timbl]
Is there a tourist's guide to the various branched in read-write-web ?
16:00:13 [timbl]
socko 219:230c73cb8e74
16:00:13 [timbl]
shiro 218:b275b9c182c9
16:00:13 [timbl]
webid 202:d12da8212f7c
16:00:14 [timbl]
webacl 138:caf19fefff4b
16:00:14 [timbl]
test 117:16ee2a3139fe
16:00:14 [timbl]
default 217:186287f5941a (inactive)
16:00:14 [timbl]
webid-java6 211:026f86a7c229 (inactive)
16:00:15 [timbl]
bblfish 121:38d13793dfae (inactive)
16:00:26 [bblfish]
the default one is the one I recommend
16:00:39 [bblfish]
I pushed webid-java6 to default a week or so ago
16:00:47 [timbl]
ok
16:00:59 [bblfish]
so the documentation on the front page should be pretty clear now
16:01:59 [timbl]
INSTALL.txt?
16:02:07 [bblfish]
Now I am working on moving this over to Play 2.0, which should be a lot better...
16:02:37 [bblfish]
README.markdown
16:02:39 [timbl]
I'm looking for stability more than betterness mostly ;-)
16:02:47 [bblfish]
It's what you see when you go to https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/read-write-web/
16:04:15 [bblfish]
does that not work?
16:04:33 [timbl]
before it didn't now it seems to again
16:04:53 [bblfish]
before what?
16:05:19 [timbl]
before this update, when I tried before .... remember i had to do ./bin/xsbt or dtg
16:05:26 [timbl]
s/dtg/something/
16:05:27 [bblfish]
ah yes. good :-)
16:05:46 [timbl]
compile works, test fails
16:06:08 [timbl]
[error] import java.nio.file.Files
16:06:21 [timbl]
[error] /devel/dvcs.w3.org/read-write-web/src/test/scala/auth/secure_specs.scala:39: object file is not a member of package java.nio
16:06:21 [timbl]
[error] import java.nio.file.Files
16:07:06 [bblfish]
mhh...
16:07:11 [bblfish]
let me look
16:09:05 [bblfish]
it looks like a java6-7 issue...
16:10:07 [timbl]
I have java version "1.6.0_31"
16:10:07 [timbl]
Java(TM) SE Runtime Environment (build 1.6.0_31-b04-415-10M3635)
16:10:07 [timbl]
Java HotSpot(TM) 64-Bit Server VM (build 20.6-b01-415, mixed mode)
16:10:27 [timbl]
Presumably verison 1.6 means Java 6?
16:10:44 [bblfish]
yes
16:10:50 [bblfish]
and this is meant to work for java6
16:11:03 [bblfish]
so its a bug if I can reproduce it. Just switched to java6
16:11:30 [rszeno]
missing dependences or permisions?
16:12:36 [bblfish]
this would be a case of me having used java7 for a while to see if there were any new things with respect to TLS
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16:14:40 [bblfish]
ah yes, reproduced the test bug
16:21:17 [timbl]
cool
16:21:38 [timbl]
so the libraries look different in j6 and j7
16:25:49 [bblfish]
they have some better File libraries
16:25:54 [bblfish]
which I was using for example
16:26:13 [bblfish]
that are able to make sure that one does not randomly create the same file
16:26:30 [bblfish]
(when creating random files)
16:32:41 [bblfish]
ah for example with Java7 I could create a temporary directory, with java6 only a temporary file...
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17:09:15 [bblfish]
timbl: I pushed a couple of patches and tests should be good now.
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17:19:25 [bblfish]
heh. I could write a bunch of BodyParsers for RDF in Play. I wonder if betehess has not already done so
17:19:54 [betehess]
nope
17:25:35 [bblfish]
context: https://github.com/playframework/Play20/wiki/ScalaBodyParsers
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